There are some days when your excitement for life is bursting wide open… and then you wake up a really grumpy dude downstairs with your interview call. Twice.

That’s what happened during the super fun conversation I had with Ever Gonzales, founder of Outlier Magazine, and visionary of a community of “Founders, Disrupters, & Mavens.”

The Interview!

Here’s the direct link to the recording page, and you can also find it as a podcast with your iTunes or phone! I recommend subscribing! Or, listen to it here:

I was really honored Ever noticed my page and requested I be a guest for his podcast, and I was excited to learn about other Outlier projects like Cotopaxi, (“gear for good” so you can adventure with ethics – AND their logo is a llama!)

The Background Noise

Curious about behind the scenes of the interview? It’s quite an epic tale.

During our call, I started out enthusiastically. I’m a softspoken person, but it’s fair to say I was louder than usual, at 10:30pm because of the time difference.

Our downstairs neighbor at the guesthouse wasn’t pleased.

He knocked once, asking me to keep it down. I apologized and dropped my volume, holding my headphone mic right up to my lips and practically whispering.

He knocked a second time, nearly at the end of the interview, and I apologized and tried to explain what was happening. I was baffled at how I could still possibly be bothering anyone.

Unfortunately, dude had some baggage. He talked over my apology and explanation and started making threats. I was taken aback by his level of anger- the situation did not warrant it, so clearly he was triggered and it had little to do with me.

I decided to shut my door. As I pulled it shut, I felt him pull it back open! My tiger side sprang into action and I made some kind of low growling “that’s not okay!” statement at him as I pulled the door back shut, locking it.

He continued to yell at the closed door for a bit, as I took a deep breath and apologized to Ever.

Whoa. Did that just happen?

The Shadows Take Shape

Listening to edited interview recording, I’m super struck by the timing of dude with what I was speaking about.

There I was, passionately expressing my truth, my fears, and my hopes!

I was standing in my power!

I was encouraging listeners to tune-in to their own intuition, and make environmental impacts, and connect with nature and animals!

And somehow I manifested a tall, angry person pounding on my door, telling me to be quiet, and actually threatening my physical security with a forceful action.

Could I have a clearer metaphor for every intuitive, sensitive soul’s worst fear? It’s impressive, how this guy embodied one of my greatest shadows. Ha!

The Show Must Go On

I insisted the interview continue, as gracious as Ever was both times to offer rescheduling the conversation. “No,” I thought, “I don’t want to be quiet, this is important to me right now.” I didn’t want to be silenced by angry man.

I ended up relocating to the rooftop garden, which wasn’t as private and had other background noise. But at least I embraced what felt right for me, despite the pushback in the moment.


And I’m grateful to dude, who I’m sure has his own share of shadows and lessons he’s in the midst of. He actually taught me a lot about myself and facing my fears.

And he gifted me this clarity:

There are naysayers to the idea that we can communicate with animals. There are folks who want us to be quiet. They will want us to stop challenging the status quo, standing up for animal rights, and expressing the truth of our souls.


To this I say: I’m just not willing to quiet down. I will go up and shout from the rooftops! (Or, at least finish the interview in a soft speaking voice 🙂 )

Photo credit: Aria Everts – An image from my series of “Cats Without Borders,” photos of felines on walls around Nan, Thailand, where this interview took place.